HMRC 0165230 - Tier 2 response processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk Attachments 27 Dec 2024, 11:40 to me This veriosn has been reformatted to make it easy to read. ---- Dear Mr Chandler, Thank you for your email dated 22 December 2024. I am sorry you have not received our letter response dated 14 November 2024, please find a copy attached. Thank you for contacting us about your National Insurance record and missing employment details for tax years 2003/24 and 2004/05. You asked us to look at your complaint again. This is the second and final stage of our internal complaints process. My role I am a complaint investigation manager. I have carried out an impartial investigation into your complaint. I have considered what you have told us and the concerns you have raised. I have used the information we have on your records to help me investigate what happened. I also looked at how we handled your complaint at the first stage of our complaints process. My investigation Our records show that BJC CONSULTING LTD was registered on 30/04/2001. No submissions were made for tax years 2003-04, 2004-05 and 2005-06 onwards and this is the reason why no employment is recorded on your National Insurance record for these years. Not paying National Insurance contributions to us at the time they were due can affect and reduce your entitlement to social security benefits. But in certain circumstances we can treat unpaid contributions as being paid. Which would mean you are entitled to the full amount of benefits. For us to do this, I need to be satisfied that when the company did not pay its contributions this was: · done without your consent or agreement · not due to your negligence. The Companies Act 2006 requires a director to look after the interests of the company’s employees and to exercise reasonable care, skill and diligence. This means that a director will usually be responsible for making sure that payments of NICs are made to HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC). You now need to write to us and explain: · reasons why the company did not meet it’s legal responsibility to pay NICs to HMRC · how the company’s failure to pay NICs to HMRC was done without your consent or agreement and was not due to your negligence · why, as a director, you think you were not responsible for the company’s failure to pay NICs to HMRC If you do not believe you were responsible for not submitting your Returns, please complete the enclosed questionnaires and return them to the e-mail below processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk. Your request will then be considered. Taking things further You have now come to the end of our internal complaints process. If you feel that we have not dealt with your complaint fully or correctly, you can contact the independent Adjudicator online at: www.gov.uk/government/organisations/the-adjudicator-s-office. You can also find more information here about the Adjudicator’s role. The Adjudicator cannot make recommendations that ask us to act outside the legislation or departmental guidance. To help us improve our services, it would be helpful if you could answer 4 short questions about your experience of interacting with HMRC during this complaint. This should take less than one minute of your time. If you would like to take part in the survey, please copy the following link into your internet search engine: www.tax.service.gov.uk/feedback/com/C29 Yours sincerely Heather Blundell Complaint Investigation Manager Operational Excellence Service Management Complaints Team HM Revenue & Customs, NIC and EO, BX9 1AA Email: processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk Telephone: 03000 553569 or 03003 229459 – calls may be recorded HM Revenue & Customs If you have any doubt about the authenticity of an email you receive which claims to come from HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC), please do not follow any links within the email, disclose any personal details or respond to it. Instead forward it to us at phishing@hmrc.gov.uk OFFICIAL From: Barry Chandler Sent: Sunday, December 22, 2024 11:20 AM To: Processing ComplaintsTeam, . (OE) Cc: Helen Morgan MP Subject: Fwd: NMRC complaint NICO 0165230 Hi, Did something get lost ? Your email of 21-Nov (copied below) said you'd reply as soon as possible. Also attached my earlier Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2024 at 15:52 Subject: Re: NMRC complaint NICO 0165230 HMRC could implement two simple systems: 1) all incoming email should be acknowledged automatically by the first mail gateway receiving it. Many govt depts do this. 2) Every correspondent should have an easy way to see the correspondence. As a last resort I will have to make a full "Subject Access Request" - for at least 20 years, which will cost the taxpayers a lot to fulfil, though it is a legal requirement on all government departments and even private sector 'data owners'. Hint - I managed to get a 70 page SAR report from DVLA just covering the last 10 years. Looking forward to your response, Barry Fact of the day: The UK civil service is now four times the size of the armed forces. Search "size civil service vs armed forces" for more info. ====== processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk 21 Nov 2024, 08:51 to me We have received your request for a second review of your complaint. We are sorry to hear of your concerns. The reference for this complaint is Customer ID 0165230. We will reply to your complaint as soon as possible. If you have a Personal Tax Account, it will show your correspondence is closed. This is because your correspondence has been passed to us for review. You should continue to pay tax while your complaint is being dealt with. If you stop or delay your payments you may be charged interest or penalties. HMRC Complaints Service ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: Barry Chandler Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2024 at 15:52 Subject: Re: NMRC complaint NICO 0165230 To: Dear Denise, Truly, Thank you for the email version, the posted version hasn't arrived (yet). There are so many errors, it will take forever to fix them all. This could cost more time and Taxpayer money if not resolved efficiently. A lot has been covered in my letter of 26 Oct 24. All I'm asking for is my State Pension to be paid in full with compensation for past 4 years. don't blame it on DWP, inefficient as they are too, I just see it as bad info fed to them. Most of this happened 20 years ago. Is it reasonable to expect anyone to keep paper like P60's that long ? There are good records of BJC Consulting 3150580 on Companies House. (ignore that they have re-allocated the company name twice since I dissolved mine in 2011) use the number. I've lost my original spreadsheets, in software that is now so out of date, BUT took precautions of downloading the Co House records and backing them up multiple ways. Let us ignore the the errors caused by Law changes 1973 – 1976 Should I write a book about government behaviour towards Students? I paid NI during my summer vacations. As a Bus Conductor, I had an NI number. Where and how did HMRC lose that data? HMRC records for BJC Consulting 2003 to 2007 bear no correlation with reality. Where did £4888.00 come from and those other columns of zeros ? I have extracted filed accounts from Companies House attached in two .zip files. Covering 2001-2005 and 2006-2009. Yours, Barry Something has to be done about record keeping and 7 year rule. Found a big solicitor firm that changes its name and deletes all its records every 6 years ! --------------------------- On Mon, 18 Nov 2024 at 10:41, wrote: GOV.UK HM Revenue & Customs Our Ref: NICO 0165230 Dear Mr Chandler We have received contact from your MP Helen Morgan on your behalf about your National Insurance (NI) record and in particular errors in a NI statement you recently received from us. I am sorry to see you have had the need to contact Ms Morgan about this issue. As a Complaints Investigation Manager within HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) I have been asked to reply. As the laws governing NI are complex and need to be explained in terms that are easily understood I e-mailed Ms Morgan on 14 November 2024 to confirm I will be contacting you separately to provide a response. I issued this letter to you on 14 November 2024, however as per your request here is my response. I have reviewed your NI record and will address the issues you have raised point by point. You have queried the amount of NI credits you were awarded whilst in further education, particularly the 1975-76 tax year. Before 6 April 1975 only people in full-time education in the years containing their 16th, 17th and 18th birthdays got Class 3 NI credits. They could only get Class 3 NI credits up to the week containing their 18th birthday. Between 6 April 1975 and 5 April 2010, everyone got Class 3 NI credits for the whole tax years containing their 16th, 17th and 18th birthdays. If you worked for an employer and earned more than the weekly earnings threshold you must pay Class 1 NI contributions. This still applies, for full-time student at college or university. Students now in full-time education at college or university do not get NI credits. Please note that Class 3 NI credits only count for State Pension (SP) Your NI record confirms you received Class 3 NI credits for the following tax years: - Tax Year Amount of Class 3 NI credits 1971-72 53 1972-73 52 1973-74 17 Based on the above information about full time education credits your NI record appears to be correct. Although you were studying at Pembroke College Oxford credits would not be awarded for the 1975-76 tax year. A qualifying year for SP can be made up through combining earnings, NI credits, self-employment, and voluntary contributions. You must have 52 weeks of full contributions for the year to qualify for SP purposes. I have checked your Class 1 (employed) postings for the period 2003 to 2007. Your NI record first shows you paid class 1 NI contributions as an employee with BJC Consulting Ltd in the 2000-01 tax year and contributions were also submitted in the 2001-02, 2002-03 and 2005-06 tax years. BJC Consulting details in the 2005-06 tax year also show a leaving date of 31 March 2006. You told us you created BJC Consulting Ltd in Jan 1996. However, the first year we received submissions from this company confirming you paid NI contributions as an employee was for the 2000-01 tax year. We also have submissions for the 2001-02, 2002-03 and 2005-06 tax years. There are unfortunately no submissions for the 2003-2004 and 2004-2005 tax years or for any year after the 2005-2006 tax year. We cannot take further trace and post action without further information from you. Please send us a copy of the P60s or payslips for your employments with BJC Consulting Ltd for any tax years you feel are missing on your NI record. Please send this to the address below or e-mail us at processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk. If you stopped working with BJC Consulting Ltd before the end of the tax year, send us a copy of your final payslips. If you can send us any documents which show you have paid NI contributions, we will look at our records again to try and find the ones you think are missing from your NI account. However, if you cannot give us any more evidence, the tax years above will not count for benefit/SP purposes. Turning now to your self employment. Your NI record has a Class 2( self employed )liability note on from 10 October1999 to 2 April 2005. I have outlined below what Class 2 NI has been paid and allocated to your NI record for the 1999-00 to 2004-05 tax years: - Tax Year Weeks of Class 2 NI paid 1999-00 NIL 2000-01 52 2001-02 25 2002-03 25 2003-04 NIL 2004-05 NIL For the 1999-00, 2003-04 and 2004-05 tax years no Class 2 NI contributions were paid as you had applied for and been awarded a Small Earnings Exception (SEE) due to low earnings for these years. Up until 11 April 2015 where a person’s earnings from self-employment were below a certain level, they could have applied to this office for SEE. This was not awarded automatically, as for many self-employed people, their self-employed income is their only income and they wanted to pay contributions to maintain their entitlement to benefits. Any application for SEE must have normally been made in advance and could not be backdated for more than 13 weeks from the date of application. If SEE was not claimed and granted, there was a legal liability to pay Class 2 NI contributions in full. To apply for SEE, a person had to complete an application form CF10, and send it to this office. The reason we asked for an official application was to confirm to us that the notes attached to the application had been read which explained how their benefits may have been affected by non-payment of Class 2 NICs. As an extra statutory concession, with no basis in law, the NI Contributions & Employer Office may have decided to waive the collection of any arrears due for a period before the award of SEE where earnings for the year(s) in question were below the SEE limit for that year. It should be noted that no contributions or credits would be awarded for a period of SEE or waiver, and this may have affected future entitlement to benefit/SP. We have no record of you being registered as self employed for NI purposes with the NI office since 2 April 2005 or paying Class 2 NI contributions since the 2002-03 tax year. If you believe this is not correct and have documentary evidence confirming you were self employed and paying Class 2 NI contributions, please forward it and I will be happy to investigate. Again, please send this to the address below or e-mail us at processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk. We have reviewed your complaint under the first tier of our two-tier complaints process. If you feel that we have not dealt with your complaint fully or correctly, you can ask us to look at it again. You should write to us at the address below or email us at processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk. When contacting us, please tell him to quote the reference NICO – 0165230 You can find more information about our complaints process at www.gov.uk/complain-about-hmrc. You may wish to share the contents of this letter with Ms Morgan’s office. Yours sincerely Mrs Denise Jobson Complaint Investigation Manager Newcastle Complaints Team HM Revenue & Customs, BP2101, Benton Park View, Newcastle-upon-Tyne, NE98 1ZZ E: processingcomplaintsteam@hmrc.gov.uk T: 03003 229459 HM Revenue & Customs If you have any doubt about the authenticity of an email you receive which claims to come from HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC), please do not follow any links within the email, disclose any personal details or respond to it. Instead forward it to us at phishing@hmrc.gov.uk OFFICIAL This message and any attachments are confidential. Unless you are the intended recipient, the information must not be used, disclosed, or copied to any other person who is not entitled to receive it. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and then delete it. The Commissioners for HM Revenue and Customs are not liable for any personal views of the sender. To help HMRC fight cybercrime, forward suspicious emails to phishing@hmrc.gov.uk and texts to 60599. Find advice and report tax scam phone calls on GOV.UK. OFFICIAL-SENSITIVE This message and any attachments are confidential. Unless you are the intended recipient, the information must not be used, disclosed, or copied to any other person who is not entitled to receive it. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and then delete it. The Commissioners for HM Revenue and Customs are not liable for any personal views of the sender. To help HMRC fight cybercrime, forward suspicious emails to phishing@hmrc.gov.uk and texts to 60599. Find advice and report tax scam phone calls on GOV.UK. 4 attachment • Scanned by Gmail